Can America Ever Have Universal Health Care?
28 06 2007I have Adam to thank for my writing anything on this particular topic, so props are in order.
On his blog last week he mentions that SICKO, the latest film by Michael Moore is coming out. Today I saw an article on Salon that also got me thinking about sharing my opinion.
I knew MM’s latest film was to do with health care in America, or rather the lack of universal health-care for its citizenry.. I have to admit that I wasn’t terribly interested in going to see it – I will probably watch the DVD, partly because Moore has shown that the message is more important than the means by which the message is put across. By doing this, I think he has marginalized himself somewhat, so even when he is making a very good point, he give people reason to side step the main issues. Still, I do believe he makes his point.
In Sicko – you can watch Moore on the vid on Adams blog – he argues for a complete change to America’s “health care system.” I’d argue myself that there isn’t really a “health care system” in America, there is insurance. Adam suggests his own proposal, in addition to Moore’s, which I think is a good one, but still think Americans would fight it.
Will a sea change happen? Has Moore set things in motion for a change? I highly doubt it and here’s why…
- While we (in other Western countries that are fortunate to enjoy universal health care) may not understand why the US doesn’t I believe the US doesn’t really want universal health care. If they did, they would argue for it. And probably get it eventually. But I’m not sure Americans themselves believe anyone should be entitled to “free” anything. That probably says socialism to them.
- Universal health care has to be paid for by higher taxes. There is no “free” health care. There is no way around this one.Those who hold up the UK’s National Health System, (which Thatcher tried to destroy, and to tell the truth, it’s been in crisis for some time), Canada’s health care system (I still can’t used to the fact that you have to pay for birth control here, which really should be free), or France’s system often leave this key fact out. None of them are FREE in the true sense of the word. I don’t believe that Americans are willing to agree to anything that will increase their taxes by at least 25%
- Publicly funded health care, to Americans, smacks of the “S” word with all its connotations. That’s S for Socialism by the way.
- You could only flirt with the idea of making corporations pay more tax to fund health care… or anything else for that matter. The tax burden placed on corporations is low for a reason. If you tax them they will leave for other low-tax climes. Or they will out-source. You don’t want them to leave. That is not good for the economy and I can’t see the American government risking this. They will back off.
- At this point in time I think that any universal health care system would have to involve the private health care providers… somehow partnering with them. Taxation alone won’t be enough, and the bill would be enourmous.
- Too many rich vested interests want to keep things just as they are.
- Many Americans think at this point it just isn’t possible. Too expensive, too late and too much apathy. Hillary Clinton tried… and that ended up dead in the water.
The article in Salon.com should have done a better job of looking at just why universal health care in America is a nice idea, but may be little more than that, except that they don’t really have that high a standard of analysis in the first place.
What came across to me from the comments was that most of the commentators don’t seem to believe UHC is even possible in America at least not in their lifetime.
More within the realms of possibility is spending trillions of $$ (their taxes) fighting a suspect war.
Thanks Adam for getting me thinking.
Your thoughts? Can Michael Moore realize his dream? Or is it impossible? Are you planning to see the film?
Technorati Tags: Sicko
Well I agree with you, I don’t think we will EVER get universal healthcare here in the States. I honestly don’t see it happening. It’s a shame our priorities are so fucked up here. I would rather the country have universal healthcare than breeders be rewarded for having children with these damn tax deductions for every spawn they produce.
[...] Efron Link to Article michael moore Can America Ever Have Universal Health Care? » Posted at Like It [...]
if there was only a way of finding a middle ground, for example, everyone has a basic need of health, then if you want a private room or better food and other, like the top of the range medicines, you can pay to have that.. that way you get the rich sick to pay more, but everyone is well.
but i agre it will never happen in america, too many businesses run medicine, who are only there to make money. not care about people. i knwo several people in america, who have pills pushed on them, which they dont really need, which costs a lot, when at worst case they only need one of the 5 they take ..
You said, “Universal health care has to be paid for by higher taxes. There is no “free” health care…” (the quote was too long so I didn’t post the entire thing). Not to go all political here, but if I remember straight, either the democrats who want universal health care, have left out the higher taxes part or they developed an obscure way to have a universal health care program without raising taxes. The latter I am skeptical about. I will honestly admit I am not a big fan of universal health care (also because I have yet to see any convincing arguments, but if there are any please point me to them), but I would like to see a bit of reform. I am also skeptical about it happening.
I am trying to find the democrat’s individual plans to get a better sense of what they are trying to do with their programs, since they are apparently not the same. But I have yet to find any adequate information.
What is interesting about the assumption of higher taxes is that, when I first met my hubby, he was living in North Carolina and we made roughly the same salary. At the end of the day, despite the illusion that Canada is “socialist” and has higher taxes, our take-home was essentially the same. The only difference was that, once we had our net salaries, he still had to fork out $500 a month for health care insurance and mine was already taken care of.
As far as convincing arguments go, how about the idea that health care and education should be basic human rights? Shouldn’t that be enough in such an obscenely wealthy country?
I find it truly appalling that in a such an obscenely wealthy country so much poverty exists, the need for access to universal healthcare exists and in juxtaposition the military budget is soaring, while citizens are needy.
I suppose that kind of thinking makes me a compassionate person and many Americans would label me a socialist. However, the truth is that significant number of poverty stricken and sick people will ultimately cost the taxpayers more than a healthy population would.
Thanks for these very interesting comments.
Childfree Chick - Ah, yes, the tax deductions. Odd isn’t it? Have as many kids as you like and there will be a tax benefit. Yet no-one thinks that a healthy nation is as important…
Mercurior - A bit like how it works in Britain, right? I agree a middle ground ought to be possible. There is no way I can believe that a country that spends trillions of dollars on weaponry cannot afford to go at least partway. I don’t think they will though. Bascally it means if you have no insurance and cannot afford to pay - you die.
Andy - I too am skeptical about the ability to provide health care without raising taxes. if you ever do find those plans, please share.
As for the argument - You mean arguments in the US, not the rest of the world, right? I think that people should have some basic health care provided as a right as Anne-Marie says.
Personally, I see universal health care as a fair and equitable way to see that all citizens have access to basic health care should they need it. It shouldn’t be down to how rich you are.
One thing is clear though.. the insurance companies have figured out exactly how valuable health care is - that’s why they are making huge profits. They’re doing a very good job fleecing everyone. it must be how the government wants it to be.
Anne-Marie - I agree they really should be basic human rights.
Brightfeather - “However, the truth is that significant number of poverty stricken and sick people will ultimately cost the taxpayers more than a healthy population would..”
Compared to what the military is costing one would think it would be a much better investment of their money. The trouble is I don’t hear many American agitating for universal health care and I wonder why. Maybe because those who could make a difference are rich and well insured. The poor, less well off and poverty stricken folk might as well be in another country it seems. It is very sad.
“The trouble is I don’t hear many American agitating for universal health care and I wonder why.”
I hear you and I too wonder why more Americans don’t lobby for universal health care. You’re right about the rich people but it’s the middle class who would greatly benefit — and they have a big voice. Why don’t they? $400-600 (which is the figure I’ve heard from American friends) a month is a big percentage of a middle income wage
Haven’t seen the movie, but my thoughts on this are:
Too many Americans are NOT sick, and they are gambling that they won’t get sick, so they don’t care if there is universal health care. So it’s not a big deal to them. As an example, In my family, people are unusually healthy. There are no hereditary diseases going around and almost no cancer (so far, knock on wood). If I had a family with history of lots of illnesses, I’d probably be more worried about health care than I am.
The entire health care system in America is broken, and it’s not just the lack of “free” health care — it’s the fact that the entire system works to KEEP people sick rather than cure them and maybe even get them addicted to some expensive drugs along the way. Many doctors are themselves addicts. At least half the commercials on the airwaves are trying to convince me to run to my doctor and get on some drug or another. And many doctors WILL give you a drug if you walk in and say, “I think I have PMDD!” or “I think I’m bi-polar!” or whatever the latest “trendy” disease is. Just look at how many doctors put kids on Ritalin just because mommy said, “I think he has ADD!”
IF we were to go to universal health care, first we’d have to fire all doctors ,pharmacists and most people in pharmaceutical companies and start over, otherwise the entire budget for the system would be blown on giving people drugs they don’t need.
Not to mention, the political system is so broken, so even if the American public got the opportunity to vote for it, the vote would be rigged to have the measure fail, just so the fatcats could keep lining their pockets.
What I hate about socialism is that it basically means parents will have everything handed to them on a silver platter and the childfree will get shafted even more than we already do. I think parents need to do LESS mooching, not more. But that’s just me.
yes britgirl, but i was thinking more along the lines of, everyone has the basic health care needs taken care of, then if they want more they pay to the health care providers extra, to defray the cost of universal healthcare.
its no longer do no harm, its what can we gouge out of people.
i know one person in america who is on 8 different pills, one to counter acta problem, ok thats fine, but the other 7 are to counter the reactions/side effects of the first lot of pills
part of the problem and the solution, is i have found being british, that there is a push for american citizens to produce, a sort of eguenics, the unprofitable people who cant afford health care die off, leaving the rest better off.
Phoena - very interesting. It really seems like the current system is a huge plan to keep the pharmaceutical companies in business making ever more profits. And since everyone is hooked good luck on changing that! And is it me or does every child these days have ADD?? Over here too What gives? They’re all on drugs, of which Ritalin seems to be the drug of choice. It’s crazy. 10 year old kids! I don’t watch a lot of tv, but even here in Canada, we get those American ads and you’re absolutely right, they are all toting one drug or the other. What a mess. I think you’re right about any change though… there are too many vested moneymaking interests to let a vote like that go through.
“What I hate about socialism is that it basically means parents will have everything handed to them on a silver platter and the childfree will get shafted even more than we already do.”
I would say they would have even more handed to them than they do now. We’re punished for not having lots of kids that entitle us to state handouts. I think it is getting worse too. But we’re supposed to understand that, well, it’s EXPENSIVE to bring up kids. That’s a whole other topic.
Christine - Maybe because, as Phoena says, they don’t think they’ll get sick enough for it to be a problem. Or they don’t want to subsidize the lower income classes.
Mercuriore - yeah, theoretically it should be possible, but in practice, if as Phoena says most are not sick and most don’t think UHC is important it’s never going to happen.
yup, i know but maybe one day one person in charge will stop looking at the budget sheets and look at the people.
I think another issue is that for many generations here in America, people tried to work hard and take care of themselves and were embarrassed if they ever had to ask for help or take handouts. These days, the younger generations are PROUD of themselves when they get something for nothing and take no pride in hard work. So some of the resentment of having to subsidize the “lower” classes might be more about resentment of having to subsidize the LAZY. Personally, I wouldn’t mind paying more in taxes to help the actual poor and the ones who fell on hard times, but I don’t want to pay more in taxes to support some teen ho who decided to have 5 kids for the welfare checks because it’s easier than working, and the gal I know who has two kids, but now that they are in middle school she still looks for ways to avoid working and get housing subsidies, education subsidies, begging friends for financial help etc. etc. — anything to keep from going to work.
OT, but I can’t help not bitching about this topic… ADD is SO last year, don’t you know? This year all the “trendy mommies are claiming their kids are autistic. Luckily for them, there are such things as mild forms of autism, so even a kid who seems fairly normal can pull off being “autistic.” *eyeroll* (I only mentioned ADD earlier instead of autism is because I don’t think there is a drug for autism.)
No.
(don’t you just love a short post?)
I saw Michael Moore’s movie last night. To say it presents devistating facts that shoot holes in our healthcare systems is a gross understatement. I work in a pharmacy and am currently a pharmacy student at the University of Minnesota. As the only industrial nation in the world without universal healthcare why are we so stubborn and pesimestic about change? A system like this has worked for the Brittish since WWII. I’m hopeful there will be change and there is one presidential candidate who may truly have what it takes…Dennis Kucinich. Check out his site for information on his stances both on this and global warming…another big issue our generation is being faced with.